I had this P.M. quite an animated talk with Senator Sumner.
He called on me in relation to Semmes. Wished him to be tried on various
important points which would bring out the legal status, not only of the
Rebels, but their cause. He thinks that many of the important points which we
have from time to time discussed, and on which we have generally agreed, might
be passed upon by a commission. I am not, however, inclined to make the trial
so broad.
Passing from this, we got on to the question of
Reconstruction. I was anxious to get an inside view of the movements and
purposes of the Radicals, and in order to do this, it would not do to put
questions direct to Sumner, for then he would put himself on his guard, and be
close-mouthed. I therefore entered into a discussion, and soon got him much
interested, not to call it excited. We went over the ground of the status of
the States, — their political condition. He, condemning unqualifiedly the
policy of the President, said, while he would not denounce it as the greatest
crime ever committed by a responsible ruler, he did proclaim and declare it the
greatest mistake which history has ever recorded. The President, he said, was
the greatest enemy of the South that she had ever had, worse than Jeff Davis;
and the evil which he had inflicted upon the country was incalculable. All was
to be done over again, and done right. Congress, he says, is becoming more firm
and united every day. Only three of the Republican Senators —Doolittle, Dixon,
and Cowan — had given way, and he understood about a like proportion in the
House. Asked if I had read Howe's1 speech, which Foot and Fessenden
indorsed. Understood Fessenden was as decided as Foot, but, not being on
speaking terms, had not himself heard Fessenden. All Congress was becoming of
one mind, and while they would commence no war upon the President, he must
change his course, abandon his policy. The President had violated the
Constitution in appointing provisional governors, in putting Rebels in office
who could not take the test oath, in reëstablishing rebellion, odious, flagrant
rebellion. Said he had three pages from one general in Arkansas, thanking him
for his speech, denouncing the President's "whitewashing" message.
I told him the Executive had rights and duties as well as
Congress, and that they must not be overlooked or omitted. That the Rebel
States had an existence and would be recognized and sustained although their
functions were for a time suspended by violence. That under military necessity,
martial law existing and the President being commander-in-chief, provisional
governors had been temporarily appointed, but the necessity which impelled
their appointment was passing away, the States were resuming their position in
the Union, and I did not see how, without abandoning our system of
constitutional government, they were to be disorganized, or unorganized, and deprived
of their local civil government and the voice of the people suppressed. That he
spoke of them as a "conquered people," subject to terms which it was
our duty to impose. Were his assumption true, and they a foreign conquered
people, instead of our own countrymen, still they had their rights, were
amenable to our laws and entitled to their protection; modern civilization
would not permit of their enslavement. That were we to conquer Canada and bring
it within our jurisdiction, the people would retain their laws and usages when
they were not inconsistent with our own, until at least we should make a
change. That I thought our countrymen were entitled to as much consideration as
the laws of nations and the practice of our own government had and did recognize
as belonging to a conquered people who were aliens. That this was the policy of
the President. He had enjoined upon them, it was true, the necessity of making
their constitutions and laws conform to the existing condition of affairs and
the changes which war had brought about. They had done so, and were each
exercising all the functions of a State. Had their governors, legislatures,
judges, local municipal authorities, etc. We were collecting taxes of them,
appointing collectors, assessors, marshals, postmasters, etc.
I saw I had touched on some views that impressed him, and
our interview and discussion became exceedingly animated.
"The President, in his atrocious wrong," said
Sumner, "is sustained by three of his Cabinet. Seward is as thick-and-thin
a supporter of the whole monstrous error as you or McCulloch."
I asked him if he supposed the Cabinet was not a unit on the
President's policy. He said he knew it was not. Three of the members concurred
with him (Sumner) fully, entirely.
I expressed doubts. "Why," said he, "one of
them has advised and urged me to prepare and bring in a bill which should
control the action of the President and wipe out his policy. It has got to be
done. Half of the Cabinet, as well as an overwhelming majority of the two
houses of Congress, are for it, and the President must change his whole
course." If he did not do it, Congress would.
_______________
1 Timothy Otis Howe, Senator from Wisconsin.
SOURCE: Gideon Welles, Diary of Gideon
Welles, Secretary of the Navy Under Lincoln and Johnson, Vol. 2: April 1, 1864
— December 31, 1866, p. 414-7
